Faith-Filled Marriage in a Secular World

[00:00:01] Speaker A: Hey, friend. Welcome to Perspectives into Practice, a place where life's stories meet practical wisdom. Together, we'll explore how faith filled perspectives can transform the way we live, love, and grow. So grab a seat, settle in, and join us on this journey to turn inspiration into action. Let's dive in foreign. Hey, friend, welcome back to Perspectives into Practice. Today we are diving into a topic that so many wrestle with and that is how to build a faith filled marriage in a world that often pushes us completely into a different view of love, commitment and relationships. And I have my sweet friend Shannon here with me today. She and her husband are such an incredible example of what it looks like to center your marriage on Christ. And they actually founded a ministry called 247 marriage. And they are restoring hope, redeeming stories, and building strong marriages. Welcome, Shannon. [00:01:10] Speaker B: Hey, thanks for having me. Glad to be here. [00:01:12] Speaker A: Yeah, I'm so glad that you're here. So before we get into our conversation, I always love to start with a fun fact. And what is more fun than babies? I know that you are a brand new grandma. [00:01:26] Speaker B: Yes, I am. It's still hard to wrap my head around it because Javi and I, honestly, we don't feel old enough to be grandparents, but Little Phoenix is seven months old and he literally has us wrapped around his finger. And we are, we have shifted so much travel and, and stays to spend more time in Arizona now. And most likely we'll be building out our boot camp Outpost center in Prescott. That'll be our home base where we do most of our boot camps because of this little guy who's just absolutely. I'm obsessed with. In love with. It's so weird because I thought I was crazy about my own girls and madly in love with them. And then he comes along and you're just like, it's a whole nother level of love that it is people talk about, but until you experience it, you don't know. And yeah, he, we, we already have our own little things that we do. There's this, there's a special book that I read him called Jesus Loves Me, ABC and Wheels on the Bus. So those are the things that we sing together and that he absolutely loves and lights up and laughs and. [00:03:01] Speaker A: Yeah, that's amazing. Yeah, it's amazing how different your world is to something that you didn't know that you needed in your life. And I feel like being a grandparent. I mean, I am not one, but I've heard that it really does change your perspective on things, which is so cool. And yeah, that's Just amazing. So, speaking of important things, marriage is one of the biggest commitments that we make. And I know that you and Javi have an incredible story. So my biggest question is that when did you and Javi first realize that it was important to build your marriage on faith? [00:03:45] Speaker B: We come from a long line of generational dependence on God. Like, that's just where we come from. So Javier, let's see. His parents have been married 55 years. My parents were married 53 years before my mom passed away. My grandparents were married over 60 years. Javi's grandparents married over 60 years. Both sets of grandparents. So we don't have a lot of divorce in, in our, like, family tree, so. And just a lot of Christ following Jesus loving marriages that we have as this example. So we feel like we carry a big mantle. [00:04:38] Speaker A: Yeah. [00:04:38] Speaker B: And responsibility. And I believe that all of those grandparents looking down on us are so proud of the work that 247 marriage is doing. And just so we're clear, we do not do this perfectly or say that we have it all figured out, because even this morning, I, Javier questioned me on something. He's like, you're really snippy this morning. And I was like, yeah, you're right. I am. I am like, I'm not gonna lie. I, I, I was overwhelmed by the large to do list before me today. And on top of it, he was actually, he's actually doing me a favor right now. He decided to go grocery shopping, where I recorded this podcast. So he's actually serving me. And he was like, tell me what you need. And I was like, I can't make a grocery list right now because I'm so overwhelmed. And so even in the midst of, like, what we do for a living, like, we don't have it figured out. We still mess up. We're human. Yeah. [00:05:47] Speaker A: Yeah. And I mean, that's a great example, though, because when, usually when we're looking up to people, they put on this perfect Persona and it looks like they've got it all together. But everyone that's on this podcast and listening knows that we are very imperfect and we live in an imperfect world. And I appreciate that you do share that because we need to know that even those that have a platform, they don't have it all together. And if you believe that, you are definitely mistaken. [00:06:19] Speaker B: We also live in the world of technology and social media, where you can, you can really portray that you do have it all together. I mean, my, my oldest daughter was just telling me about a documentary about a Mormon mom named Ruby Frank. Who was a major influencer who portrayed online that her life was very, very well put together. [00:06:45] Speaker C: Yeah. [00:06:46] Speaker B: Ordered, structured, faith, family, friends, and it was quite, quite the opposite. [00:06:53] Speaker A: Yeah. [00:06:55] Speaker B: One of the thing. One of the best compliments that I get from our closest friends and family is that they tell us when they watch us on social media, they're like, you guys are the same people. I don't. I don't get dressed up for reals. We don't use a ton of filters. We shoot stuff where we're at. If it's outside, if it's in the fifth wheel, like, it just doesn't matter because we're just not those kind of people who are going to pretend to put on a show. [00:07:27] Speaker A: Well, also, that's a lot of work. It's like, a lot more work to put on another. Like, it's already enough to be me. [00:07:34] Speaker B: Right. [00:07:35] Speaker A: I can't put on somebody else. But, I mean, I feel like that's where the world gets it wrong. And we are stuck in this secular circulation of wanting to be someone else and not portraying who you truly are. But when it comes to marriage. Yeah. Right. But when it comes to marriage, I feel like there's so many, I guess, secrets that, like, we hold and, like, oh, well, we don't. We're gonna have a different marriage in front of people than what we have behind closed doors. And that's where the enemy really is getting at, because he's like, yeah, you're right. You don't have the perfect marriage. And I'm just gonna continue to. To break that down. So we have to have some kind of a biblical principle, something, a foundation that we build our marriage on. That's not what the world tells us. [00:08:34] Speaker B: You don't have to look very far. So the world's idea of marriage leaves 51% of marriages in disillusion and divorce. So obviously their model's not working when half of it is gonna fall off. [00:08:49] Speaker C: Yeah. [00:08:50] Speaker B: Into the deep, dark pit. So that tells you something right away. But I mean, so if we go back to scripture, I mean, God talks about how sin. It's fun for a season. [00:09:02] Speaker C: Yeah. [00:09:03] Speaker B: So there's something intriguing and that draws us. Our. Our sin nature is drawn towards that. And it is fun for a season, but all seasons come to an end. [00:09:15] Speaker C: Yeah. [00:09:15] Speaker B: And when we. When we don't make God and biblical, a biblical worldview of marriage, our foundation, you start to get fractures, cracks. Your foundation falls off. You realize your foundation, we don't even have foundation. [00:09:33] Speaker C: Yeah. [00:09:33] Speaker B: We're literally just standing on sand trying to build a marriage. I see it all the time. We just finished up a boot camp a couple days ago in. In Northern California, and I had a couple say. She's like, when you. When you're talking about foundation, she's like, we. We didn't even intentionally talk about or build a foundation. And she. She almost felt bad. And I was like, don't feel bad because of maybe something you didn't do, because now you know. So when we know better, we do better. [00:10:06] Speaker C: Yes. [00:10:06] Speaker B: So now that you know, it's like, okay, now, like, what we said to you at the end of boot camp is, your old marriage is done. Throw it away. It's in the trash. New marriage, same people. [00:10:20] Speaker C: Yeah. [00:10:21] Speaker B: So you get an opportunity to go back home and be like, okay, let's start from scratch. [00:10:25] Speaker C: Yeah. [00:10:26] Speaker B: Let's get out a blueprint, and let's talk about what this foundation is going to look like. The thing is, with boot camp, I wrote it. I wrote a blog about this called after the boot camp High is they get really excited. [00:10:40] Speaker C: Yeah. [00:10:40] Speaker B: Those first two weeks, and then it's. [00:10:42] Speaker A: Like, yeah, life happens back. [00:10:45] Speaker B: But the intentionality that it takes to build that strong foundation of those daily disciplines of. We're gonna remember to pray together. We're gonna remember that we're going to turn technology off at this time. We're going to have more meals around the dinner table. We're just all these practices that they want to put in, and then they slowly start to fall off. [00:11:09] Speaker C: Yeah. [00:11:09] Speaker B: And that foundation that they were excited about building two weeks ago, it wanes a little. [00:11:16] Speaker C: Yeah. [00:11:16] Speaker B: So in that we have to find our. What it means to be steadfast and resilient. And that word, steadfast, not a sexy word, but what it means is that whether life is good, bad, up, or down, we have to be consistent in following after God's word and what he's asking and inviting us into, rather than basing our whole, like, life and our schedule and everything that we do on feelings. [00:11:54] Speaker C: Yeah. [00:11:54] Speaker B: Feelings are good. You own them. But we can't base decisions on them. [00:11:58] Speaker C: Right. [00:11:59] Speaker B: Because your feelings will lead you down a dark rabbit hole. [00:12:03] Speaker C: Yes. [00:12:05] Speaker A: Every time, so. Every time. [00:12:07] Speaker B: Yeah. Well. [00:12:08] Speaker A: And, you know, you said a phrase that I love is, you know better, you do better. And then I also challenge that point to you also after you know better and you get to choose to do better or to fall, like you said, fall back down that rabbit hole and go off to a place that got you where you were in the beginning. And so what are Some daily. Like you were, you were mentioning some daily habits. What are some things that we can help to bring our marriage into this faith filled bucket and out of the secular world? [00:12:44] Speaker B: First of all, I would speak directly to the men because God always starts at the top and he. And he always starts with the man of the household who is called to guard, guide and govern. [00:12:56] Speaker C: Yeah. [00:12:56] Speaker B: Over that home. Be the prophet priest of your home. So I would speak directly to the men and say that your job, what God is commanding and calling you to do, is to lead your family spiritually, emotionally and physically. [00:13:13] Speaker C: Yeah. [00:13:14] Speaker B: So break it down and ask yourself as a man, how am I protecting my family? How am I spiritually leading them? How am I emotionally investing into my wife and my children? And if your daily habits don't align with that, that's where alignment needs to happen. And as a wife, because most of the time our, our DMS are filled with weary wives who are desperate for their husbands to lead. [00:13:46] Speaker C: Yeah. [00:13:46] Speaker B: It's rarely the ev. The, the other way around that we have. Occasionally we have husbands who have a, a wayward wife. But most of the women are faith filled women who are desperate for their husbands to lead. [00:14:02] Speaker C: Yeah. [00:14:02] Speaker B: So I would encourage those wives instead of praying for your God to change your husband. God, do this, God do that. Start with yourself and pray. God, what do you want to work on in me? [00:14:22] Speaker C: Yeah. [00:14:22] Speaker B: And that always shudders people because they're like, what? What? But I'm not the problem. Yes. But you ain't glowing in the dark either. So God always has something that he can work on in you. [00:14:33] Speaker A: Yeah. [00:14:34] Speaker B: Alongside raising up this warrior husband that you're praying for. So ask God, what do you want to do in me? What do I need to examine and change? And the second thing is pray for the man he is becoming. [00:14:51] Speaker C: That's good. [00:14:52] Speaker B: God is not done with him yet. Unless he's six feet under the ground. He's done. But as long as he's above ground and breathing, God is still working. God can do a new thing. [00:15:01] Speaker C: Yeah. [00:15:02] Speaker B: The scripture tells us so you have to pray for the man he is becoming. God, I pray for his heart that you would guard his mind. That you would place strategic people in his life to speak life into him that will challenge him, that he would have a hunger and a thirst for you like no other. Like, we have to pray those things over our spouse in order to see the change that we want to see happen. [00:15:29] Speaker C: Yeah. [00:15:30] Speaker B: The thing is, is that you, your desire to want your husband to lead is such a good thing. Like, let's not misconstrue that. That's such a beautiful thing. You desire to be led spiritually by your husband, and that is a good biblical thing. The problem is wives go about it all the wrong ways. We say and we do things. We over mother our spouse, we parent them, we reprimand them, thinking that somehow that's going to get them into shape and become the warrior husband we desire them to be. And it's just not going to happen. So those daily practices of how you, how you pray for your spouse, how you're praying for yourself, and what are the, what is the ethos of your home? What is, what does dinner time look like if you have a family? Like, are you sitting around the table technology free? Are we praying over our meal? Are we, Are we, Are we, Are we sharing those stories of the Old and New Testament with our children on a daily basis? Are we talking about the things of God? Are we involved in a local church? I talk to so many people. They're like, yes, we love God. I'm like, are you involved in your local church? No. Yeah, okay. Find community. Yeah, there are no, there is no such thing as perfect church. If you got hurt, I'm sorry, but we need to get over it and put on our big girl panties and go find a body that is teaching the word and get involved. Find a place to serve. Find community. Find a small group. Because as God pours into us, we'll be able to pour out to other people. And there are broken people all around you who need maybe a cup of coffee from you and your spouse, maybe a dinner, maybe a short hike just to encourage them. [00:17:30] Speaker C: Yeah. [00:17:30] Speaker B: So we always think, well, we're not far enough along or, you know, we don't have it all figured out. Yeah, well, we don't have it all figured out either, but this is what I'm doing. Yeah, so find, Find your tribe and then find people to pour into. Because as you pour into other people, somehow supernaturally, that strengthens your own marriage and challenges you. Yeah, but we isolate ourselves because that's what the enemy wants. He wants you to isolate and become an island and think that you're the only one that has this problem. You are of. You are of no use to, to the body of Christ, your neighborhood, your community, or your church. And it's just stinking thinking. So we, we have to understand what God's word is and how to apply it and really examine what your daily practices are. The ethos of your home and everybody's home is Different. We have different jobs. We have different schedules. Maybe mom stays at home. Maybe mom works full time. Like, you have to figure out what the ethos of your home feels like. But how is it biblically centric? And how. How is God's word flowing through your home daily? I, I. Our. Our very best friends from. From junior high got married two years after us. They just celebrated their 30th anniversary, but they just came to the Lord maybe three years ago. [00:19:00] Speaker C: Wow. [00:19:00] Speaker B: So they're new to. Incredible. [00:19:02] Speaker C: Yeah. [00:19:03] Speaker B: And one of the things that I taught her was to turn on worship music in her car in the house while you're making dinner. [00:19:12] Speaker C: Yeah. [00:19:13] Speaker B: And it's so cool because when I'm over at her house now, I'm like, oh, it's a Chris Tomlin song playing. Or you're like, oh, you got worship music on in the car. She's like, it's all I listen to now. [00:19:25] Speaker C: Yeah. [00:19:25] Speaker B: And it's just one small change has shifted the ethos and atmosphere of her car in her home to allow the Holy Spirit to dwell there. Because it's so easy to jump on the train of what my spouse is doing wrong, what I don't like about my marriage, how they irritate me, how I wish this was different. And it's like, how about we start with an attitude of gratitude, Enter into his gates with thanksgiving and into his courts with praise of God. Thank you for the. That man or woman you placed in my life. [00:20:06] Speaker C: Yeah. [00:20:07] Speaker B: They're such a gift. Thank you for. For they're. They're a daughter or a son of the most High King. [00:20:13] Speaker C: Yeah. [00:20:14] Speaker B: Help me love them the best way that I know how. Help me to have perseverance. Help me to have strength. Help me to have wisdom and discernment in the things that come out of my mouth and my actions towards my spouse that they would glorify you, God. [00:20:32] Speaker C: Yeah. [00:20:32] Speaker B: I mean, these are bold prayers. [00:20:34] Speaker C: Yeah. [00:20:35] Speaker B: But so often our prayers are about how our spouse needs to change. [00:20:41] Speaker A: Well, and in the secular world, it's all pointing fingers at other people instead of taking responsibility and knowing, like, there's two people in a marriage and both of you are wrong, like, we're all sinners. And when you put two sinners in a marriage, like, if you don't have Christ as the mold, the center, the foundation, then it will all fall apart. And that's. It's so important to know that and to point back to God. And I'm so glad that you said that, because it's so true. So true. [00:21:17] Speaker B: Yeah. Well, marriage is meant to kill you. It's meant to kill self. And this is what we, we, we don't talk a lot to the dating world on our social media, but occasionally I'll throw a couple nuggets in there and say, listen, if you're not willing to lay down your selfishness and slay your selfish spirit, don't get married. [00:21:41] Speaker C: Yeah. [00:21:42] Speaker B: You're, you're not ready. [00:21:43] Speaker C: Yeah. [00:21:44] Speaker B: Because there's no room for you to be this I want it all my way and be married. Yeah. It doesn't work. Right. They end up getting married and then they wonder why this isn't working and they jump ship and they go to the next marriage and expect the same thing. [00:22:07] Speaker C: Yeah. [00:22:08] Speaker B: And you know, the, the world is coming up short and there's not. They, they've lost sight of what a covenant is because we've gotten so far away from our biblical foundation as a country. [00:22:24] Speaker C: Yeah. [00:22:26] Speaker B: And they've really exchanged covenant for a contract. So in a contract, if I go buy a car, I'm paying them and I'm expecting this car with this warranty, with this amount of oil changes like you promised me that I would get all these things if I pay this amount of money, if I make this monthly payment. And that's contract. [00:22:50] Speaker C: Yeah. [00:22:51] Speaker B: And there's a time and a place for contracts, but not within marriage. So marriage is meant to image and reflect Christ and Christ came and took responsibility for something that wasn't his fault. [00:23:06] Speaker C: Yeah. [00:23:07] Speaker B: In the same way that we take on our spouse, the good, the bad and the ugly. And even when things hit the fan, they weren't my fault, but I take responsibility for them. That's radical ownership. [00:23:20] Speaker C: Yeah. [00:23:21] Speaker B: We've lost sight of what a covenant means. And I usually change the language in a lot of our posts. I'll either add it or change words to always say covenant. Covenant in marriage. Covenant. [00:23:37] Speaker C: Yeah. [00:23:37] Speaker B: Because I want people to get familiar with that word and remember what that, the significance of what that means, what God is calling us into. [00:23:48] Speaker A: Can you, can you give us a short like description when you use the word covenant? Can you tell us what does that mean in the biblical sense for those that may never heard that before For a marriage. [00:24:01] Speaker B: Yeah. Simply means that we are, we're, we're signing up for something that's. We're going to require us to lay it all on the line. So in the same way that God came and redeemed, sent his only son to redeem a broken world, he didn't have to do that. He didn't have to send his son. [00:24:28] Speaker C: Yeah. [00:24:29] Speaker B: Because the sins of man weren't his responsibility, but they became his responsibility. [00:24:35] Speaker C: Yeah. [00:24:35] Speaker B: So that radical ownership is saying in marriage for Javi and I, there's no back door in our marriage. We're. I'm in this till the end. [00:24:47] Speaker C: Yeah. [00:24:48] Speaker B: If it's broken today, go to bed, wake up tomorrow, try again. [00:24:52] Speaker C: Yes. [00:24:53] Speaker B: If it's something that needs fixed, we find where we're gonna get help. Like, there's. There's just no back door. Because I made a covenant before God. I didn't sign a contract, and I said, for better or for worse. [00:25:11] Speaker C: Yeah. [00:25:11] Speaker B: And we're all in for the better. Of course, it's easy trips, the starting a family, the getting a new dog, whatever. Remodeling a kitchen, yada, yada. But the worst. What about when your spouse has an addiction or a cancer diagnosis comes through or the loss of a child? There's so many things that we. That we don't understand that we're saying yes to at the altar. Because you're. Yes. And your covenant is not proved at the altar. Your. Yes. And your covenant is proved in the valley of the darkest day of your marriage. [00:25:49] Speaker C: Yeah. [00:25:49] Speaker A: And we don't know when that's going to come. But it's not an if. It's a when there will be dark days. And that's where that foundation is so important. And when we. When we set that up, and that's the praying together, and that's the, you know, not listening to the things of this world. And it's being in relationship with other, you know, Christian believers and other, you know, happily married couples, people that have been married longer than you, so that you can see, like, wow, they. They've done it. They've sucked, and they've done it, and they're still here together showing what it looks like. And you're right. We can't do this on our own. And we weren't made to do this on our own. And, you know, I've heard. I hear a lot. Marriage is 50. 50. I. No, it's not. It's 100. 100. You have to give 100 of you. They have to give 100 of them. And then I guess it's 100, then you gotta let the Lord in. So it's a 300%. It's a big deal. And we have to have that. Look, like you said, there is no backdoor in a marriage. In a marriage covenant, there is no back door. In a contract. It can be broken. And if you go into a Marriage. Secularly thinking that, oh, well, we're married, but I can end it whenever. That's going to be hard times. That's going to be hard times. And we really have to. We have to change our perspective and our mindset on what we have seen in the world for what a marriage looks like. And what does the Bible and God say that our marriage is supposed to look like? So as we wrap this up, Shannon, what is one perspective that you can give our listeners that they can apply today in their marriages? [00:27:44] Speaker B: Our tagline that says I don't have to, I get to. [00:27:47] Speaker A: Yeah. [00:27:49] Speaker B: We use it all the time, and people always joke around about that. Like, we just said, the have to. Of all the great things that can go on in marriage. Yeah. We're excited to. But when your spouse is going through an addiction or your spouse lost his job or your spouse is going through depression, whatever it is, you don't have to show up for them. You don't have to come alongside them, but you get to. You get to do that with them. You get to be that safe place for them to land. You get to be that person, prayer warrior for them. [00:28:34] Speaker C: Yeah. [00:28:34] Speaker B: You get to be on the front line to protect them. [00:28:42] Speaker C: Yeah. [00:28:42] Speaker B: And that's. That's really where I would say emp. Empathy and compassion are different. Compassion kind of means you walk by your spouse and you pat them on the shoulder. [00:28:58] Speaker A: They're there. [00:28:59] Speaker B: Okay, honey. [00:29:00] Speaker A: Yeah. [00:29:01] Speaker B: You're gonna be okay. We're gonna get through this. Drops to their knees and gets into the mess with them and sits with them and carries the weight of the burden that they're feeling at that moment. [00:29:12] Speaker C: Yeah. [00:29:13] Speaker B: Of. I'm not gonna leave you, and I'm gonna carry this with you. [00:29:17] Speaker C: Yeah. [00:29:18] Speaker B: And when we see empathy show up in marriages, that's when we see a complete transformation of a marriage, because we no longer are operating in compassion, but we're actually empathizing with our spouse, and it changes things. [00:29:39] Speaker C: Yeah. [00:29:39] Speaker B: I mean, what if God would have walked by the world and was like, all right, world, you're really messing up. I hope you can get your act together. I mean, he decided to send his son to die. [00:29:55] Speaker C: Yeah. [00:29:56] Speaker B: For us. I mean, if that's not the ultimate example of what empathy looks like, God's heart broke so much that he wanted to do something about it. [00:30:11] Speaker C: Yeah. [00:30:12] Speaker B: I mean, that's. That's crazy. That's crazy love. [00:30:15] Speaker A: It is. [00:30:15] Speaker B: That's a wor. That's a love that the world doesn't understand that we operate in and. And that you get to do this. [00:30:23] Speaker C: Yeah. [00:30:23] Speaker B: You can leave and go to any other marriage. Common denominator is always you. We always want to say it's the other person, but it's like, let me tell you, it's you. [00:30:33] Speaker C: Yeah. [00:30:34] Speaker B: And if you don't learn what compassion and empathy look like right now and the difference and how radical ownership will change the trajectory of your marriage, you're. You're going to live in the pl. You're going to live in the land of average. [00:30:55] Speaker C: Yeah. [00:30:56] Speaker B: And everybody doesn't want to be average. They're like, we want a thriving marriage. We want this. It's. It's going to take work. It's good work. [00:31:02] Speaker A: 100%. [00:31:03] Speaker B: It's good, good work. It's not. It's hard work, but it's so worth it. [00:31:08] Speaker C: Yeah. [00:31:08] Speaker B: So worth it. [00:31:09] Speaker A: Which is in everything in life, is when you put in that hard work, you're like, we did that. We did that together. And. Yes. Wow. Amazing. Shannon, this has been so wonderful. I would. I know you have so much more things that you can share with us, so if you ever want to come back on here and chat with us, I know that everyone would love to have you on here. Friends, if you love this episode, if you are encouraged by this episode, please, please share it with a friend. Someone who needs to know it. Follow the podcast so that you never miss an episode. And remember that even the small shifts in perspective can lead to big changes. Now go put those perspectives into practice. Talk to you next time.